U.S. Boarders Open, Are We Truly Fighting the War on Terror?

U.S. Boarders are Open, Are We Truly Fighting the War on Terror? I want to believe that our government is truly committed to fighting the war on terror, but I can’t because our boarders remain open. Am I just paranoid to believe that terrorist are coming into our country at will and undetected through our porous boarders. I believe we are exposing our throat to the enemy by leaving our boarders open and our failed immigration policy the status quo. Shouldn’t the war on terror begin at our boarders?

[jtdc]

You got my vote Lexi. And apparently the majority of voters in Arizona and maybe even Kalaforneeahh. But the politicians just don't get it. That's why I am not that big on our "representative democracy". They are supposed to work for "We The People". But instead we elect who we want to be our dictator!

[NetGear]

Of course we should close our borders, but that is easier said than done. The left, which still has a fair amount of power in this country (libertarians included), would not allow such a thing.

Will take a few more Nine-Elevens.

[Osiris]

A) Who is responsible for our borders?
B) Where do they get their funding, and where does that funding originate?
C) Do you understand what it would take to lock up our borders, and how much THAT would cost?
D) Do you have any good suggestions, that would reduce, or eliminate our "porous" border situation, that would not involve great expense?

I do not ask these questions as an objection to tightening our borders, but more that I keep hearing and reading such materials, but never see much in the way of an in depth discussion on how this can be achieved. Sometimes, I amd given the picture that some people would build a wall, completely across our northern and southern borders, and station our military along them at various points.

The only kind of "fence" that I can see being of any good, would be one that is five feet thick, extends 15 feet under ground, and 60 above ground. The various checkpoints are relatively easy to lock up, but the wide open expanses in between, leave an awful lot of terrirtory to cover. There is something to be said about use of modern technology, and such, but that still requires more manpower and costs.

[NetGear]

A) Who is responsible for our borders?

At this point, the Border Patrol (Department of Homeland Security), which is not enough firepower, in my opinion.

B) Where do they get their funding, and where does that funding originate?

Federal Budget; taxpayer, of course...

C) Do you understand what it would take to lock up our borders, and how much THAT would cost?

No one completely understands what it would cost or entail, however, after a few more Nine-Elevens, cost won't be a huge factor.

D) Do you have any good suggestions, that would reduce, or eliminate our "porous" border situation, that would not involve great expense?

There are no good, easily implemented solutions. If you have any, I'm sure Tom Ridge would like to hear from you. By all means, please keep us posted.

[jtdc]

A) Who is responsible for our borders?
The Federal Government!

B) Where do they get their funding, and where does that funding originate?
Funding comes from federal taxes. The funding originates from obstinate lawmakers.

C) Do you understand what it would take to lock up our borders, and how much THAT would cost?
It would cost almost nothing. It is a matter of redistributing the resources we already have.

D) Do you have any good suggestions, that would reduce, or eliminate our "porous" border situation, that would not involve great expense?
Yeah! Stop funding the United Nations efforts to protect the borders of other countries and have our troops protect our own borders.

Instead of military exercises over civilian areas, put that manpower along the border to train. Hardly any cost change at all.

The only kind of "fence" that I can see being of any good, would be one that is five feet thick, extends 15 feet under ground, and 60 above ground.
How about not putting ladders on the sides of the already 10 foot high fences? How about motion sensors to detect digging? Even proximity motion detectors used in many homes and businesses?

It is not an insurmountable task at all. The big problem was pointed out by Netgear:
The left, which still has a fair amount of power in this country (libertarians included), would not allow such a thing.

This is not a Left v. Right problem. The silence on both sides of this issue is deafening. The majority of the 911 terrorist were in this country illegally. Putting up a wall or military on the boarder would simply make the boarder a harder obstacle course to navigate. The answer is somewhat more complex. We must take away the incentive for those who come her illegally. Making it more challenging alone will not work. First any illegal found in this country is deported immediately. Irrespective of children and property. Businesses found in the employ of such felons would be sanctioned. The Democrats want the votes the Republicans want the cheap layer. The taxpayer is caught holding the bag. Education, welfare and medical is denied. Face it we are feeding, clothing, providing medical care and education to these felons and their progeny. All the while 7 billion US dollars are funneled to Mexico a year. I say we use what ever means necessary to stem illegal immigration. But hey 89 billion dollars would be a great start!

plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose

[NetGear]

Originally Posted by lexloci

Businesses found in the employ of such felons would be sanctioned.

Are all illegals felons?

[Osiris]

I don't know exactly, but some, if not all of the 9/11 terrorists came to the US legally, but because they failed to keep up their status, became illegal. So as it is, walls do not, as security goes, make.

I doubt that we will ever see such walls, and I have to admit, that I am glad of that. On the other hand, there are numerous other avenues to explore, in attempting to make our borders more secure. For one thing, a far more even handed approach to both sides, the Mexican authorities and the US authorities who man the borderlands. Aiding Mexico to build a improved economy. Better enforcement of our own immigration laws. We already have many laws directed at various areas, employers, private citizens, and the like. But the problem is, that everyone seems willing to look the other way, and Lex is right about this, it is NOT a left vs right issue at all.

[Osiris]

One more thing about immigrants and terrorists. They do not need to come here illegally. They can arrive legally as students, business visas, etc. So there is a definitive need for the complete and total cooperation between law enforcement agencies such as the CIA, INS, and the FBI.

[rachel]

Well, here's something that's being tried anyway.


Drones Tested to Patrol US-Mexico Border

Reuters
Friday, October 10, 2003; 1:34 PM


MONTERREY, Mexico (Reuters) - The United States is testing pilotless drone aircraft, used in Iraq and Afghanistan, on the U.S.-Mexico border where they might be deployed to detect drug traffickers and illegal immigrants, a government spokesman said on Friday.




The Department of Homeland Security is conducting tests of the unmanned aerial vehicles, or UAVs, in remote areas of the Sonoran Desert in Arizona, Mario Villarreal, spokesman for the U.S. Bureau of Customs and Border Protection, told Reuters.

"The UAVs, which have played an important role for the military in Iraq and Afghanistan, are under consideration for use by the Department of Homeland Security," Villarreal said.

They are being deployed from Fort Huachuca and Gila Bend, Arizona, for test flights in remote areas of the desert that have become well-known corridors for narcotics trafficking and immigrant smuggling.

Drone aircraft were used for aerial photography and spy missions during the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.

They are the latest of the military-style hardware and techniques to be used on the 2,000-mile border, where homeland defense has been beefed up since the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks.

Agents also use American Eurocopter AS350 "A-Star" helicopters with on-board, satellite tracking systems and infrared, night vision capabilities to track illegal activity.

Border patrol officers have recently set up military-style campsites in the wilderness where they live for 30-day periods, while conducting patrols deep into the desert on foot and horseback, Villarreal said.

"They are basically camping out in an operation that shows what lengths the border patrol will go to protect their homeland. They are away from their friends and family," he said.

Villarreal said no decision has been made on whether the government will ultimately use the drones for surveillance.

[rachel]

There is a certain difference between the Left and Right on this issue. Here in California, the Left is behind the drivers licenses for illegal aliens legislation that Red Davis recently signed. Also, the Left is behind the move to institute free college tuition for illegal aliens. The Left prefers the term "Undocumented Immigrant" to Illegal Alien. The Left is whence the cries of outrage and sympathy arise when illegal aliens are killed or injured sneaking into this country. The Left was behind chucking out the legislation WE VOTED FOR that would have stopped some of our tax dollars now going to illegal aliens in the form of education and medical coverage.

So, when Net commented that the Left wouldn't stand for closing our borders, he's not just Left-bashing. Just see how fast the Left's lawyers and activists will descend should any measures we take to close our borders result in injuries/deaths of illegal aliens while they are sneaking into our country.

I will not be surprised in the least if some NAACP lawyer doesn't file suit about the drone planes on the basis of invasion of privacy or some similar claptrap.

Isn't it the Left who squawks all the time about the "Civil Liberties" and "Constitutional Rights" of illegal aliens when we try to crack down as it is?

So yeah, there is a Left/Right issue here...and it will become a bigger issue should we actually attempt to close our borders. Wait and see.

[Osiris]

I'll be down in Fort Huachuca next week. Let you know if I "spy" any of them out there.

[jtdc]

Aiding Mexico to build a improved economy.

That is more a matter of getting tough. We have been pumping money into Mexico officially and forgiving debts when they defaulted on previous attempts at building up their economy.

The unfortunate answer is enforcing strings on any help. If their citizens illegally come to this country and use our hospitals and services, the cost of those services must be deducted from any aid to Mexico or Mexico must be billed and required to reimburse those costs. If they want our help they will have to allow us to help. We must not tolerate a demand for money which will end up in the pocket of their underworld. Much like dealing with street people. If you give them money to buy food, they will use it for drugs, If you give them food, it will be used for what you intended.

One more thing about immigrants and terrorists. They do not need to come here illegally. They can arrive legally as students, business visas, etc.

Ahh, but there is a record of those "illegal aliens"! Those who come here "undocumented" are even more invisible. It is not concentrating on one single fix, as many have pointed out. Closing the border helps in more aspects than just prevention of terrorism. But the government must actively pursue those whose visa's have expired. They must become fugitives.

Another is close inspection of imports. This, done diligently, will cost money. But terrorist's without weapons are not as much of a threat.